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Moving Forward to '17-'18


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#26 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 23 May 2017 - 08:38 PM

Im just going to make this simple and say I will disagree with probably 90% of you when it comes to our goalie situation.

 

Gibson has shown growth each and every season. There were times where he could/would have also been brought back sooner if it wasnt for Berniers play. His injuries have become less frequent and I believe a lot of that has to do with maturity in goal and honing his craft. I do believe that his style is partly at fault for his injuries, and I think thats also why we've seen him evolve a bit in goal. I think he will always be a bit scrappy and unorthodox but if he continues to real it in like he did this year, I dont see injuries being as much of an issue. Gibson played 52 games. If it wasnt for Bernier being on a hot streak, he would have probably played 60. Part of it is situational.

 

Out of all goalies with a minimum 40 games, Gibson ranked 4th in sv%  with a .924 and ranked 4th in GAA with 2.22 and was 6th in shutouts with 6. He was also starting the most games when the Ducks were looking like they werent even going to make the playoffs, and he still put up those numbers.

 

When we look at trends and patterns, Gibson has only gotten better and injuries less frequent. Doesnt mean injuries isnt a thing but hes trending int he right direction.

 

You wanna give out grades and rate Bernier as damn near perfect? Go for it. There is a reason Gibson played more games and was the starter int he playoffs. Bernier did a great job as a BACKUP. Not as a starter, a backup. He had glimpses where it looked like he could maybe be a #1, and then we saw the drop off. Bernier is a career backup now.

 

So sure, as a backup, Bernier, A-. As a starter, Gibson, with those numbers...?

 


they need to trade Gibson. He's too injury prone. That was my only reservation about committing to him long term. Look what happens, he gets injured during the conference final, an elimination game to boot. His health is unreliable, I don't want him as their #1 goalie.

 

He wasnt injured in an elimination game. He was injured in game 5. Part of the reason he was inured was because he got trucked 3-4 times the game before and then gets trucked again in game 5 while making some pretty damn nifty saves. But I digress.... Without even trying to debate here.... who becomes your goalie then? What are you trading Gibson for? What does your future in net look like?



#27 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 10:12 AM

Did you know that John Gibson had never played in more than 10 consecutive NHL games until this year's playoffs - when he played in 16 straight until Game 5?

 

That surprised me.

 

 

3. JOHN GIBSON WORE DOWN

Ducks goaltender John Gibson had never played in more than 10 consecutive games heading into the 2017 Stanley Cup Playoffs. He missed 17 of Anaheim's final 21 regular-season games with a lower-body injury.

But the Ducks started Gibson in their first 16 playoff games before a hamstring injury forced him out after the first period of Game 5 against the Predators. Jonathan Bernier did a stellar job filling in for Gibson late in the regular season, but he gave up six goals on 34 shots during the final five periods of the series for a save percentage of .824.



#28 Rooch20

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 10:32 AM

@HH: Precisely!  I think we're being a bit too harsh on Gibson considering that this IS the first time he's started multiple series'.  Like RGS said, he's trending up-and-up and he's only 23 at this point.  Goalies usually don't come into their own until 25-26, maybe even 27 years old so, I think he's still ahead of the curve.  Trading Gibson now would be considered foolish.



#29 ducks4adam98

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:17 PM

Im just going to make this simple and say I will disagree with probably 90% of you when it comes to our goalie situation.

 

Gibson has shown growth each and every season. There were times where he could/would have also been brought back sooner if it wasnt for Berniers play. His injuries have become less frequent and I believe a lot of that has to do with maturity in goal and honing his craft. I do believe that his style is partly at fault for his injuries, and I think thats also why we've seen him evolve a bit in goal. I think he will always be a bit scrappy and unorthodox but if he continues to real it in like he did this year, I dont see injuries being as much of an issue. Gibson played 52 games. If it wasnt for Bernier being on a hot streak, he would have probably played 60. Part of it is situational.

 

Out of all goalies with a minimum 40 games, Gibson ranked 4th in sv%  with a .924 and ranked 4th in GAA with 2.22 and was 6th in shutouts with 6. He was also starting the most games when the Ducks were looking like they werent even going to make the playoffs, and he still put up those numbers.

 

When we look at trends and patterns, Gibson has only gotten better and injuries less frequent. Doesnt mean injuries isnt a thing but hes trending int he right direction.

 

You wanna give out grades and rate Bernier as damn near perfect? Go for it. There is a reason Gibson played more games and was the starter int he playoffs. Bernier did a great job as a BACKUP. Not as a starter, a backup. He had glimpses where it looked like he could maybe be a #1, and then we saw the drop off. Bernier is a career backup now.

 

So sure, as a backup, Bernier, A-. As a starter, Gibson, with those numbers...?

 

Sounds like you didn't "hear me out" because you repeated most of what I said :)

 

Gibson is heading in the right direction (like I said), and we have a better goalie situation than mos of the league (like I said). B is a pretty good grade. If he could consistently put up those numbers, rather than posting .950+ for a stretch then sub .900 and averaging out to a good number. If that makes sense.

 

And yes, Bernier is graded as a backup, as I said. Which is why he scored higher, he was better as a backup than Gibson was as a starter to me. Not much better, there's not a lot of room between A- and B!



#30 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:23 PM

Not much better, there's not a lot of room between A- and B!

 

Depends on the teacher ;)


 

Sounds like you didn't "hear me out" because you repeated most of what I said :)

 

 

I heard you out, I must just not have been hearing what you were actually saying. Almost seemed like you were pitting them up against eachother as opposed to grading 1 as a starter and 1 as a backup.



#31 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:27 PM

 

Sounds like you didn't "hear me out" because you repeated most of what I said :)

 

Gibson is heading in the right direction (like I said), and we have a better goalie situation than mos of the league (like I said). B is a pretty good grade. If he could consistently put up those numbers, rather than posting .950+ for a stretch then sub .900 and averaging out to a good number. If that makes sense.

 

And yes, Bernier is graded as a backup, as I said. Which is why he scored higher, he was better as a backup than Gibson was as a starter to me. Not much better, there's not a lot of room between A- and B!

 

Just FTR,

 

Bernier in the regular season: 33 starts, 21 wins, 7 losses, 4 OT

Gibson in the regular season: 49 starts, 25 wins, 16 losses, 9 OT

 

 

They both have to "wear" those stats even though the entire team is playing those games, but, ya know.  They're goalies.  That's how it works.



#32 ducks4adam98

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:33 PM

 

Just FTR,

 

Bernier in the regular season: 33 starts, 21 wins, 7 losses, 4 OT

Gibson in the regular season: 49 starts, 25 wins, 16 losses, 9 OT

 

 

They both have to "wear" those stats even though the entire team is playing those games, but, ya know.  They're goalies.  That's how it works.

 

Those numbers are almost as close as getting an A- or a B ;)

 

This is all splitting hairs really... I mean our position in net is has got to be the envy of most teams in the league.

 

If someone wants to argue Gibson deserved an A+ I'm all for that conversation, but it sounds like I'm selling him down the river with a B! When I went to school that wasn't bad!



#33 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:36 PM

 

Just FTR,

 

Bernier in the regular season: 33 starts, 21 wins, 7 losses, 4 OT

Gibson in the regular season: 49 starts, 25 wins, 16 losses, 9 OT

 

 

They both have to "wear" those stats even though the entire team is playing those games, but, ya know.  They're goalies.  That's how it works.

 

Thats why I dont like bringing int he team stats like W/L into the equation. When you look at their individual numbers, Gibson has better numbers (SV% and GAA) even though he won less games on average. THat tells me one thing and will tell you guys something else. FOr me, W/L has to do more with how the team played in front of those guys, than how the goalie played behind them.



#34 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 24 May 2017 - 01:41 PM

 

Those numbers are almost as close as getting an A- or a B ;)

 

This is all splitting hairs really... I mean our position in net is has got to be the envy of most teams in the league.

 

If someone wants to argue Gibson deserved an A+ I'm all for that conversation, but it sounds like I'm selling him down the river with a B! When I went to school that wasn't bad!

 

I think a B is a pretty generous grade.  He won 25 and lost 24.  Now, he got points in 34 out of 49, so that's a good thing.

 

The 3-on-3 thing, any goalie who has to be out there when Getzlaf AND Perry are on the ice is gonna be sorry.  Unless they are on the other team.  What I'm trying to say is that the Ducks are horrendous at 3-on-3.


 

Thats why I dont like bringing int he team stats like W/L into the equation. When you look at their individual numbers, Gibson has better numbers (SV% and GAA) even though he won less games on average. THat tells me one thing and will tell you guys something else. FOr me, W/L has to do more with how the team played in front of those guys, than how the goalie played behind them.

 

Early in the season Gibson was a wreck.  Most pucks that hit him went right back into the slot, 10-20 feet from his net.  Many times there was an NHL forward from the other team in that same place.

 

Started 49 games.  Gave up 3 or more goals in 20 of those games. (41%).  Gave up 4 or more goals in 9 of those games. The Ducks won 2 of those 20.

 

Bernier started 33 games, gave up 3 or more in 15 of those. (46%).  Gave up 4 or more goals in 5 of those games.  The Ducks won 7 of those 15.

 

 

Bernier has Gibson beat clearly in snowmen given up.  1-0.

 

 

 

I look at Gibson similarly to how I look at Ritchie.  Improved this season from last, still very young, needs to work more this off-season and take another significant step this coming season.  And I'm hopeful that both those guys can and will.



#35 MrsBevo

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 03:05 PM

https://www.nhl.com/...tes/c-289612194

 

Murray gave the injury update.  So the question is with Lindholm and Vatanen needing surgery for torn labrum, that pretty much eliminates Sami's trade value.   If Lindholm is out 4 - 5 months (October to November return) and Vatanen is worse (yowza), then does that also mean they are less likely to be snagged by Vegas in the June draft?  



#36 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 04:22 PM

https://www.nhl.com/...tes/c-289612194

 

Murray gave the injury update.  So the question is with Lindholm and Vatanen needing surgery for torn labrum, that pretty much eliminates Sami's trade value.   If Lindholm is out 4 - 5 months (October to November return) and Vatanen is worse (yowza), then does that also mean they are less likely to be snagged by Vegas in the June draft?  

 

Respectfully, I disagree that it hurts trade value at this point. I also dont think it affects their likihood of being taken int he draft either.

 

Any GM is going to look at those guy, see hwo well they played despite injury and it will be a positive. If this was mid-season, sure their immediate values are hurt. But its the post-season now and these guys were part of a team that made it to the WCF's. Its expected there are going to be some injuries.

 

I want to say it was Freddy, but thinking back he might have been hurt once he was a Leaf. I swear we've traded a guy who had just had surgery before for a decent return. COuld be wrong.

 

Anyone trading for Vatanen is going to see how the surgery goes, see what the doctors are saying and play it from there. They arent trading for a guy to play right now, they are trading for the future. Typically shoulder injuries/surgeries dont put a guys career at risk and Id be willing to wager that there isnt much fallout from labrum surgiers when it comes to the players future.

 

You trade for Vatanen, knowing he probably wont be playing until November or December and then you have 4 more years of him.



#37 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 04:32 PM

Thompson with a hairline fracture int he foot. Love the ugy, but his injury history is starting to make it really hard to bring him back. Eaves had high ankle sprain/bone bruise, could push off. Loved his presence when he was healthy, would consider a low value contract for a couple of years.Shaw had a torn gro(OOUUCCHHH)iiiinnn.  Bieksa had a torn MCL, says no surgery needed. Rakell had a high ankle sprain.

 

you dont just recover from a torn MCL in 9 games. Bieksa was playing pretty damn well, especially for having that kind of injury. Thompson playing with that fracture, also played extremely well.



#38 ducks4adam98

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 05:16 PM

Vatanen's injury - I think it definitely hurts his trade value, not a lot but it does. A guy who might play 60 games next season is just not as valuable as he would be if he played 80. I agree in the amount of games a team would be acquiring it's a drop in the bucket for the next few years, but I think part of the value of Vatanen is his age and that he's entering his prime. Any chunk of games is going to make a GM offer less.

 

I don't however think it makes him any less likely to be snagged by Vegas if we don't protect him (which we shouldn't) or can't deal him. Obviously there isn't really a recent comparison for expansion drafts like there is for trades, but we're talking more big picture and building a franchise. At that point, unlike a trade in any other circumstance, I don't think a guy with no real injury history missing a fraction of a season has any effect on long term plans building a franchise if you have the chance to get a young talented forward.



#39 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 07:20 PM

Interesting with those injuries to those two guys.  Kudos to them for playing hard.

 

I think BMGM has a few things as possibilities, but there will probably not be a whole lot of changes, and that may not be a bad thing.  Get a young guy or two onto the roster.



#40 JLL

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Posted 25 May 2017 - 09:10 PM

Thanks for the link to the Ducks site Mrs. B - I was glad to see that before commenting.

 

Been quietly listening to all that you guys have said. I guess at the end of the day, I feel a lot more optimistic about the future than a lot of folks here.

 

After reading about the injuries, I'm pretty impressed that the guys played as hard and as well as they did for as long as they did.

 

And while I know RC was trying to put a positive spin on everything, I think he's right that there's a lot to be positive about. Our young players are only going to get better. And as they do, they'll pick up slack from Getzlaf and Kesler. Fowler and/or Lindholm will become a top-ranked defenseman. With more conditioning work, Gibby can become less fragile. I am reminded of the 2011 Bruins who won the Cup with absolutely NO stars on the roster except Chara and a hot goalie.

 

Some changes need to occur, but not many; as HH said, too many permutations. But we do need to get a young, skilled FW, pretty much regardless of cost. Gotta protect Fowler, Lindy and Manson at all costs. I'd like to keep Eaves if we can get him for 2 years at $2M per. And Ryan Miller might be a great backup/mentor option for Gibby if we can get him to sign for cheap. In any event, lots of possibilities.

 

I'm looking forward to next year. I believe we'll be in the thick of it again.

 

GO DUCKS!



#41 Kariya9

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Posted 06 June 2017 - 03:29 PM

I honestly can't believe it's been 10 years to the day. I can still here the roar of the crowd, see the looks of the faces on all the ecstatic fans and the rowdy party on Katella afterwards. Good times.

#42 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 11 June 2017 - 12:20 PM

I wonder if Matt Cullen - if the Pens win - will retire and if he does, if he wants to coach.  And if he does, if he would be a good add to the Ducks.

 

I think he would.



#43 DropThePuck

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 10:13 AM

Curtis Zupke‏ @curtiszupke 6 minutes ago

Ducks announce preseason schedule. Kicks off Sept.19 at San Jose; Vegas Golden Knights come to Honda Center on Sept.24.

https://twitter.com/...413915693309952



#44 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 01:04 PM

Am I the only one that thinks that these pairs make sense next season:

 

Getzlaf/newguyreceivedintheVatanendealormaybeJonesorSteele

Rakell/Silfverberg

Kesler/Cogliano

Vermette/Shaw

 

 

 

Then Perry, Ritchie, Kase, Wagner, Boll move around?

 

I think they need to put Rakell at C and put Silf on his wing.



#45 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 01:40 PM

Am I the only one that thinks that these pairs make sense next season:

 

Getzlaf/newguyreceivedintheVatanendealormaybeJonesorSteele

Rakell/Silfverberg

Kesler/Cogliano

Vermette/Shaw

 

 

 

Then Perry, Ritchie, Kase, Wagner, Boll move around?

 

I think they need to put Rakell at C and put Silf on his wing.

 

I dont hate it BUT I think Cogs is gone and I dont know that RC will want to F with the chemistry so much that he takes both wingers away from Kesler. I agree with moving Rakell to center but I think Silfver stays with Kesler and they get another scorer ont hat line



#46 thedozen

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 01:44 PM

Regarding Cogs, Eric Stephens still seems to think that they're only protecting 3 defensemen (plus giving up whatever enticement they are giving the Knights not to select Manson if you believe Bob McKenzie).  Obviously it's just a guess on his part and a trade could happen just the same.



#47 HockeyHeaven

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:03 PM

 

I dont hate it BUT I think Cogs is gone and I dont know that RC will want to F with the chemistry so much that he takes both wingers away from Kesler. I agree with moving Rakell to center but I think Silfver stays with Kesler and they get another scorer ont hat line

 

He very well could be moving on.  In that case, I put Kase with Kes.  On a case-by-case basis.....


Regarding Cogs, Eric Stephens still seems to think that they're only protecting 3 defensemen (plus giving up whatever enticement they are giving the Knights not to select Manson if you believe Bob McKenzie).  Obviously it's just a guess on his part and a trade could happen just the same.

 

If they do go 7-3-1, then I would have to think Cogs gets covered.



#48 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 15 June 2017 - 02:05 PM

Regarding Cogs, Eric Stephens still seems to think that they're only protecting 3 defensemen (plus giving up whatever enticement they are giving the Knights not to select Manson if you believe Bob McKenzie).  Obviously it's just a guess on his part and a trade could happen just the same.

 

Im not talking about protection though. Right now Ducks have like 5 or 6 forwards they HAVE to protect. They will probably protect Cogs (unless he is part of some backhanded LV deal) simply so they can save him for a trade later.

 

Ducks want to shake things up and add a bit more scoring to their top 9. Looking at who the currently have, if they are wanting to shake things up, Cogs would be the logical piece to swap out. Hes not a scorer, not a finisher. Hate to lose him, but makes sense for the direction of the team.



#49 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 08:13 AM

ANA has put Simon Despres on waivers to be bought out

 

 

 

Now this, I dont understand. You cant buy-out an injured player right?


Ducks would like to re-sign Patrick Eaves, and the feeling is mutual. Contract talks expected to pick up after next week's draft.

Also on Ducks, I'm told contract negotiations with Cam Fowler are "progressing"... Can't officially sign extension until July 1

 



#50 RGS_Quack93

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Posted 16 June 2017 - 08:22 AM

Boy, when you read people comments ont he Despres news, you find out how many people really dont know s* about s*.

 

"Woo maybe we can bring him back to PIT"

"Hey, wasnt this trade called called the steal of the deadline? HA right"

"Noooo, this is going to hurt the ducks defense for years to come!"

 

Oye. Pit fans, Kings fans and Ducks fans. THey all dumb.






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