45 replies to this topic

[QuacksMeUp]

You used to go to Staples center and cheer for the Kings, a "few" years back?

I go to a ton of hockey games and watch a ton of hockey games that do not involve the Ducks. However, I only cheer for the Ducks if they are playing in the game I am watching. I see no problem with cheering on good hockey players on other teams when there is no Ducks sweater out there. For instance, I would sit there and cheer Lubo on and turn right around if the Queens happen to be playing say Detroit and cheer for a great play by Fedorov -- both great players in my opinion who -- oh gee, became Ducks!

[HockeyHeaven]

I go to a ton of hockey games and watch a ton of hockey games that do not involve the Ducks. However, I only cheer for the Ducks if they are playing in the game I am watching. I see no problem with cheering on good hockey players on other teams when there is no Ducks sweater out there. For instance, I would sit there and cheer Lubo on and turn right around if the Queens happen to be playing say Detroit and cheer for a great play by Fedorov -- both great players in my opinion who -- oh gee, became Ducks!

You think you could make it to a Pens-Caps game? Ya know, 8 and 87? It's worth a shot...

[QuacksMeUp]

You think you could make it to a Pens-Caps game? Ya know, 8 and 87? It's worth a shot...

I'll try for Sid but not for Ovie. I'm actually quite satisfied with Getz, Pears and Bobby.

[HockeyHeaven]

I'll try for Sid but not for Ovie. I'm actually quite satisfied with Getz, Pears and Bobby.

Huh. I'd take Ovechkin over any of those three right now, deadline be damned....

[Todrick]

I'll try for Sid but not for Ovie. I'm actually quite satisfied with Getz, Pears and Bobby.

Really?

Crosby isn't the best player in the league... he's not even the best on his team.

Plus his face... it... well... It just makes me want to punch it.

there, I said it.

[HockeyHeaven]

Really?

Crosby isn't the best player in the league... he's not even the best on his team.

Plus his face... it... well... It just makes me want to punch it.

there, I said it.

I'd take Crosby over any of those three as well. I love Getz, Pears, and Bobby, but both Ovechkin and Crosby are better, and have plenty of great hockey ahead of them.


How about this? Would you give up 15, 10 and 9 for 8 and 87?

[QuacksMeUp]

Really?

Crosby isn't the best player in the league... he's not even the best on his team.

Plus his face... it... well... It just makes me want to punch it.

there, I said it.

Who of the four players in this conversation do not have either a Stanley Cup or an Olympic medal? I rest my case.

[DUX714]

Who of the four players in this conversation do not have either a Stanley Cup or an Olympic medal? I rest my case.

Ask that same question 3-1/2 months from now and the answer may be nobody.

[Todrick]

I'd take Crosby over any of those three as well. I love Getz, Pears, and Bobby, but both Ovechkin and Crosby are better, and have plenty of great hockey ahead of them.


How about this? Would you give up 15, 10 and 9 for 8 and 87?

you misunderstood me...


Leagues Best:
Ovechkin
Malkin
Crosby

in that order.

Who of the four players in this conversation do not have either a Stanley Cup or an Olympic medal? I rest my case.

I think you case may be resting because it dropped dead...

Marcel Dionne was a beer leaguer too I assume.

[HockeyHeaven]

you misunderstood me...


Leagues Best:
Ovechkin
Malkin
Crosby

in that order.

No, I figured that's what you meant. All I was saying was that I would swap any two of Perry/Getz/Ryan for Ovechkin and Crosby yesterday. At 5 AM. In my sleep. I might even swap all three for those two.

[Todrick]

No, I figured that's what you meant. All I was saying was that I would swap any two of Perry/Getz/Ryan for Ovechkin and Crosby yesterday. At 5 AM. In my sleep. I might even swap all three for those two.

Amen.
We don't have a single player of their caliber...

Getzlaf probably could be... but he's too lazy

[HockeyHeaven]

you misunderstood me...


Leagues Best:
Ovechkin
Malkin
Crosby

in that order.



I think you case may be resting because it dropped dead...

Marcel Dionne was a beer leaguer too I assume.

I'd take Dionne right now. He's still alive, right? If he hasn't assumed room temperature, get him a jersey...

[DUX714]

Amen.
We don't have a single player of their caliber...

Getzlaf probably could be... but he's too lazy

Remember after the Cup when Getz said on live tv, "We played our balls off."

Maybe that need to be the slogan for the last 19 games. Can some make t-shirts that says

DUCKS HOCKEY

We play our balls off

[TroyLoney]

Remember after the Cup when Getz said on live tv, "We played our balls off."

Maybe that need to be the slogan for the last 19 games. Can some make t-shirts that says

DUCKS HOCKEY

We play our balls off

A more accurate one might be:

DUCKS HOCKEY

We play hard when we feel like it

[HockeyHeaven]

Amen.
We don't have a single player of their caliber...

Getzlaf probably could be... but he's too lazy

And here's the thing with those five players. They are the players they are going to be. Ovi and Sid entered the league and "BAM!" They haven't "developed" into great NHL players. They were the first time they hit NHL ice.

Getz, Perry, and Ryan? They are never going to be that type of player, imo. Very good NHL players. Not transcendent. There's a reason Sid and Ovi are the face of the league. East coast has about 30% to do with it. The other 70% is because they are both witches...

You come to site for Ducks fans?


Looked up your history....

This gem is priceless:


Real hockey genius we have here folks.

Great call out! What a tube...

[DUX714]

A more accurate one might be:

DUCKS HOCKEY

We play hard when we feel like it

True - I was hoping the slogan I wrote would help them remember what it is like to be hungry and give a damn.

[Just Duckie]

You used to go to Staples center and cheer for the Kings, a "few" years back?

Yeah, unlike Kings fans, some people are hockey fans as well as fans of their team.

[HillerGirl]

Getzlaf probably could be... but he's too lazy

i think what killed them in a way was getting a cup at 22 (?) after barely getting their feet wet in the NHL...
look at Teemu, Jiggy, T-bone, Prongs... those guys have played, injured themselves, lost miserably, fell short of a game or two, questioned their ability to stay in the league... and FINALLY some after a decade some a bit earlier WON IT!
whereas it was "ok... we made it to NHL... i hear they have a cool shiny cup in the end... whoa!look at it!" with Twins...

[Deuce]

i think what killed them in a way was getting a cup at 22 (?) after barely getting their feet wet in the NHL...
look at Teemu, Jiggy, T-bone, Prongs... those guys have played, injured themselves, lost miserably, fell short of a game or two, questioned their ability to stay in the league... and FINALLY some after a decade some a bit earlier WON IT!
whereas it was "ok... we made it to NHL... i hear they have a cool shiny cup in the end... whoa!look at it!" with Twins...

That really slowed down Sid...

[HillerGirl]

That really slowed down Sid...

Sid didn't take it the first year... he was constantly told that he is the best but it took him some time to get the cup... 4 years actually... Getz took it in his first full year in the NHL
that's first...
and second... they have different personalities... it's been told over and over again... Getz needs motivation (usually as i understand it something big and shiny at the end), Sid doesn't...
i wish Getz was like Teemu in the sense that he juts LOVES the game... you can see that Teemu is beaming when he is on the ice... it seems he would not be able to survive without this game in some way or another in his life. he is hockey, he doesn't just play it.

[DUX714]

Part of the problem is the young guys all think the are Joe Namath!! Hey maybe I am a little jealous, but I think if these guys were settled down with wife and family they might be better and more consistant on the ice.

[Sojourn]

you misunderstood me...


Leagues Best:
Ovechkin
Malkin
Crosby

in that order.

Most GM's would disagree with you - including the Penguin's own GM. Crosby is valued more highly than Malkin.

I'd also take Crosby over Ovechkin, but for different reasons. Ovechkin is the better individual talent, but if I want to make my team better I'm picking Crosby. Not only is he the more complete player, but in big games Crosby has a history of showing up while Ovechkin seems to come and go.

[Todrick]

Most GM's would disagree with you - including the Penguin's own GM. Crosby is valued more highly than Malkin.

I'd also take Crosby over Ovechkin, but for different reasons. Ovechkin is the better individual talent, but if I want to make my team better I'm picking Crosby.

I'm not buying it.

Thing about Crosby is he needs a team... He needs good players to make him great...

Ovechkin on the other hand is good enough to do it by himself... and if given a decent player to work with(Morrison) he makes them better.

[TroyLoney]

Nothing like coming into the Lubomir Visnovsky trade thread and reading a discussion about who's better - Crosby or Ovechkin?

[Sojourn]

I'm not buying it.

Thing about Crosby is he needs a team... He needs good players to make him great...

Ovechkin on the other hand is good enough to do it by himself... and if given a decent player to work with(Morrison) he makes them better.

He needs good players to make him great, Todrick? Have you seen the linemates he's had? That argument is ridiculously flawed. Crosby gets players like Guerin and Kunitz. Not exactly studs. Hell, on the blue line he had Whitney too, who was usually playing when he was on the ice. We're not talking the cream of the crop, Todrick.

And you don't think good players help Ovechkin a crapload too? Does Backstrom not ring a bell? Or Mike Green? You think it's a coincidence that his goals went up with Backstrom as his center?

Every player needs a team. That's one of the things that makes hockey great. But Ovechkin is the one who has had better linemates most nights recently.

Nothing like coming into the Lubomir Visnovsky trade thread and reading a discussion about who's better - Crosby or Ovechkin?

Sorry.

I just find the argument old and tired. Crosby might be over-hyped, but for Todrick to imply he's a product of the players around him is just stupid.

[Captain-Crunch]

Ovechkin on the other hand is good enough to do it by himself... and if given a decent player to work with(Morrison) he makes them better.

As much as I would love to agree, I can't. Look at their rookie year, 2006. Both had obviously impressive point totals, but neither had any big names to work with. Crosby did it on is own (102 points). The next highest scorers for the Penguins that year were Gonchar and Recchi with 58 and 57 points, respectively. It's hard to say they were the ones to propel him that high.

Ovechkin in 2006 had 106 points. The Capitals' next highest scorers were Zubrus and Halpern, with 57 and 44 points, respectively. Not much help either.

Therefore, saying Ovechkin is better because he can do it without help and Crosby can't just isn't true. The stats prove it.

[Todrick]

Therefore, saying Ovechkin is better because he can do it without help and Crosby can't just isn't true. The stats prove it.

The respective Rosters the last 3 years and the accolades prove the opposite...

Ovechkin:
NHL All-Rookie Team: 2006
NHL First All-Star Team: 2006
NHL First All-Star Team: 2007
NHL First All-Star Team: 2008
NHL First All-Star Team: 2009
NHL Player of the Year – Sporting News: 2008
NHL Player of the Year – Sporting News: 2009
NHL All-Star Game Selections: 2007
NHL All-Star Game Selections: 2008
NHL All-Star Game Selections: 2009
Calder Memorial Trophy – NHL Rookie of the Year: 2006
Kharlamov Trophy – 2006
Kharlamov Trophy – 2007
Kharlamov Trophy – 2008
Kharlamov Trophy – 2009
Lester B. Pearson Award (Most Outstanding Player): 2008
Lester B. Pearson Award (Most Outstanding Player): 2009
Hart Memorial Trophy (Most Valuable Player): 2008
Hart Memorial Trophy (Most Valuable Player): 2009
Art Ross Trophy: 2008 (112 points)
Maurice "Rocket" Richard Trophy: 2008 (65 goals)
Maurice "Rocket" Richard Trophy: 2009 (56 goals)

Crosby:
Art Ross Trophy (Most points in the regular season) 2007
Lester B. Pearson Award (Best player as voted by his peers) 2007
Hart Memorial Trophy (Most valuable player in the NHL) 2007
NHL First All-Star Team 2007
NHL All-Rookie Team 2006
NHL All-Star Game 2007
NHL All-Star Game 2008
NHL All-Star Game 2009
Mark Messier Leadership Award Jan. 2007

[notsgnivil]

The respective Rosters the last 3 years and the accolades prove the opposite...

Ovechkin:
bleh

Crosby:
bleh

That does not "prove" one or the other does it without help. If I could have one or the other crosby is a no brainer for me for a variety of reasons. If you actually look at who they play with I think most would agree that Ovechkin has better linemates (not saying anything about depth, 2nd line etc) than crosby does. In fact - I'm not sure anyone would disagree with that.

I get the impression you havn't seen many pens or caps games.

[General:Moters]

It's basically a question of belief in the end with those two. Crosby is definitely not just a product of his linemates, which at times have been made by Crosby (as Colby Armstrong), although other players like Malone that were supposed to live and die due to Sid have proven to be valuable in other spots as well. He is great, no doubt about it. I do however agree that he did have more of a supporting cast than Ovechkin, at least until this year. In the end, I personally prefer Ovechkin, because I find his game more interesting and I can stomach some of his borderline dirty plays easier to stomach than some of Sid's dives - another one of which happening tonight. (Ovie has had a couple himself, but not nearly as regularly, imo.)

Anyway, both are elite players and a case can be made for both. It necessarily comes down to preferences and personal opinion.

[Captain-Crunch]

Stating my case:

I would say Ovechkin is better because he can score and pass as well as Crosby, but he can also play physical, be defensive, and play every other aspect of the game. I have rarely, if ever, seen Crosby play defense, and he does not play anything near a physical side of the game. One "fight" doesn't count.