212 replies to this topic

[ahtikullervo]

gazeta.ru on this declaration of WAR!!!

I hope someone faster translates into English entirely, but some key issues (not word to word, but I guess clear enough):

Russian league does not sign contract with NHL as it sees in shameful for Russians.

Russian league press atache quit. Rene Fasel (President of IIHF) warned Russians, but without any result. President of Russian Federation of Ice Hockey considered new deal with NHL economically good (Russian clubs would have got $ 150,000 more than under previous contract).

"Can we make the contract better or just say Yes or No to that," asked Shabdurasulov (Spartak), " it is very important to undertand why we gathered here!".

Steblin said that all answers will be taken into account.

Velichkin (Metallurg Magnitogorsk): "It means we can refuse the contract in current form? Yes, but then we are unprotected against NHL. They still can steal our players and we will get nothing!"

Vaisfeld (Lada): "What happends if we do not sign the contract?"

Steblin: "I guess nothing..."

Velichkin shouted: "In any case we will get abused by NHL. "

Tikhonov: "If we sign they will keep us in slavery for next 5 years. In 11 years we have not been able to find common language with NHL and once again we age given only 3 days to quickly sign."

Steblin: "It is not like that!"

Tikhonov: "It is exactly that. Once again only NHL benefits from this contract. It is total madness. We are given bare gift of 4 million $."

Steblin: "Let's do it without emotions, let's speak in a calm voice. - I am on Your side!"

Velichkin: "Ok let's do it without emotions. We have to answer the question if we are citizens of our country? Viktor Tikhonov tells the truth! This joke is pushed to our faces. We are abused with this contract. It is absolutely impossible to discuss with NHL. They do not take us as human beings. They think we are monkeys, who do not need to be talked with. I do not like this new contract at all."

Steblin: "Do we have any suggestions?"

Velichkin: "It is visible that NHL is afraid of us. We saw the "real value" of the "best league in the World" players at lockout days. There is 5 % of real stars and the rest of the guys are not better than the players who play in Russian league. And if we are demanded to sign, we can just step out of IIHF."

Steblin: "No, that is not necessary!"

Velichkin: "Let's lose some money, but let's not lose our pride! Contract in current form can not be signed! I'm against!"

Jakovlev (Lokomotiv): "We are considered to be idiots. We are blackmailed. This contract offered by NHL is just ridiculous. And how can we once again sign a new contract withot getting ready. Year ago we wrote down our suggestions. Where are they? They we not even looked at."

Shalaev (RHL): "They are in my computer!"

Jakovlev (Lokomotiv): "After signing this contract I do not understand why should I keep school for youth? For American league? For Fasel? I do not need that!"

Steblin: "If the question is how the $$$ will be divided, then this is yet under discussion."

Ak Bars representative: "Let's show them teeth!"

Tikhonov: "I vote no for contract!"

Titov (Moscow Dynamo): "But we are in favour of the contract, but not in current form though."

Shabdurasulov: "We should not only reject contract, but also consider our next steps. We must gather all teams, pay to lawyers, who can win in court in America. Make NHL honour our contracts."

Velichkin: "They are stealing our players, but now we can steal theirs! We can easily give better contracts than clubs overseas and better deals."

Shabdurasulov: "Most important is not just to stop here, but to go all the way!"

Shalaev: "We do not stand a chance in American court, I asked their lawyers. I will not even tell You what all did we discuss, but lawyers tell, we do not face a chance."

Vaisfeld: "I am afraid of such question. If we do not honour their contracts as they do not honour ours, what will happend? Now we have Aleksandr Semin who has contract with Washington. We could be punished for that."

Steblin: "I think - not. They will take it to court, nothing happends before that. Teams for sure will not be punished, maybe only (if) player."

Vote was taken. Unanimous no for contract.

Steblin called Fasel: "Hello Rene! How do You do? Why? We voted against contract, what will happend to us Rene?"

Presidents: "Let Bettham fly here! We will have negotiations in here with him. At Lubyanka (famous prison in Moscow, KGB torture arena). And on airport he will be met by representatives of HK MVD (hockey team of ministry of internal affairs, most probable home of Oleg Tverdovsky next season)! They will be much more negotiable in America!"

[ahtikullervo]

[PortBeach13]

Omg what the hell are we doin?!?!

[hockey2k]

I don't see why the Russian Federation and the NHL need a deal anyway. I think players should honor their contracts wherever they sign them. Sign a contract with a Russian team, and you play there until your contract is up. Sign with the NHL, and you play there (with the understanding that you might actually be playing in the AHL until better suited to North American play.) Players shouldn't be able to sneak out on the contracts they sign with the Russian teams to go play in the NHL, and vice versa.

[ahtikullervo]

Was the war in the air on draft day already? The first Russian player picked only at #70? Is that the end (pause?) in Russian kids coming to NHL???

[Veca]

I think the Russians see an oppurtunity to get some of the better players and are taking it. If they don't honor the NHL agreements, they will be able to keep some players. It's called looking out for number one.....

[ahtikullervo]

Suprisingly nothing on the issue on tsn.ca or any other North American site. Other Russian and European sites have a lot, but not as colorful and detailed as in gazeta.ru...

[Veca]

It would be nice if we got some of the news directly, but....
Thanks Ahti for keeping us up to date, it makes it easier to understand just what is going on....

[ahtikullervo]

When will those things be clear?

Volchenkov, Bryzgalov, Malkin, Semin, Svitov, Chistov, Frolov, Datsyuk ... what will these kids do???

[ahtikullervo]

Shalaev interview

Sorry guys, it is in Russian and I am not ready to do it too... Still it is very interesting stuff... Looks like this declaration of war is serious. Shabalov still is convinced that Team Russia will play in Olympics & Worlds...

[PortBeach13]

Thanks for posting the info Ahti! I just sense bad stuff... Why cant the IIHF agree with Russia?

[ahtikullervo]

Thanks for posting the info Ahti!   I just sense bad stuff... Why cant the IIHF agree with Russia?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

IIHF president Fasel sais it - then it will be chaos. Total war between NHL & IIHF? No NHL players at Olympics. No NHL players at Worlds? International hockey would fall back into the mid 80s... And there is no over all European consensus. For many kids with puck out there stories of B.Salming, J.Kurri, H.Loob and others is more than inspirational... West European best guys have been playing in NHL for ages...

Answers? I do not have them... Very hot atmosphare in this meeting of Russian league decision makers!

And NO comment from any site in North America suprises me the most? Balls anybody?!

[Aahhke]

I don't see why the Russian Federation and the NHL need a deal anyway. I think players should honor their contracts wherever they sign them.  Sign a contract with a Russian team, and you play there until your contract is up. Sign with the NHL, and you play there (with the understanding that you might actually be playing in the AHL until better suited to North American play.) Players shouldn't be able to sneak out on the contracts they sign with the Russian teams to go play in the NHL, and vice versa. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They need a contract because of this whole Draft Thing. Some Scouts come to Europe and see a promissing talent and then a NHL Team claims the rights for this player. Nothing happens for some time until the NHL-Team decides that it needs that player because of some injury or so. The original Team then looses maybe its 1st or 2nd line center and looks dumb! With this contract between NHL and the other Leagues the NHL get permission to just "take" a player and the Original Team gets some Money.

But when a Player like Jagr has a deal with NYR then its illegal for him to sign in Omsk without beeing prepared to go back th NY at the new Season or else he could be charged for that.

[Kimi]

Shalaev interview

Sorry guys, it is in Russian and I am not ready to do it too... Still it is very interesting stuff... Looks like this declaration of war is serious. Shabalov still is convinced that Team Russia will play in Olympics & Worlds...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll translate this is you give me a bit. I'll post it once it's done.

[Kimi]

It took a while, but here it is:

Vice-president of the PHL, Vladimir Shalaev, has told to the newspaper that Russia will refuse the of ratification of the contract from NHL.

Q. Which managers have question or disagreed with the contract with the NHL?
A. All the presidents have expressed unanimously: the contract doesn’t look good to have an arrangement with the Russian clubs.

Q. Than they did not accept the draft of the contract?
A. The league considers, that there should be a contract between the Super League and NHL inexistence. But not the kind that was offer us because of an ocean. The contract should take into account all wishes of both parties, cover all interests. And to us have thrown this, saying here, take it. The NHL wanted to steel the rising generation. We could not agree with it.

Q. That is clear. But what will happen next? Will any negotiations will carry on?
A. The main thing the NHL should understand, is that we at all do not want to enter confrontation with them. We now want to begin some negotiations. First of all, we shall meet the management of the IIHF, we shall discuss the situation with them. Then we shall begin negotiations and with NHL.

Q. How can punish Russia for this? For example, outlawed from the international competitions?
A. No, such measure is excluded. Russia will participate in the world championship and Olympic Games.

Q. What else questions were discussed by presidents besides the contract from NHL?
A. We solved the problem on creation of association of employees. Have removed disagreements in a question of cooperation between the Federation and the Super League. Unfortunately, some questions have still remained. Besides the issue of a reduction of a ban to the hockey player Andrey Nazarov. But the majority of the presidents have decided to not change the initial decision. The player cannot take part in the Russian competitions for this year. And last Vyacheslav Bulanov, the best Referee from last season has told to us about innovations in rules.

Q. And what is not so smooth with relations between the Super League and Federation?
A. We had two conciliatory commissions which did not come to a common opinion. In particular, on a question who will develop and assert internal documents of league. Representatives of Federation want to be engaged in all of it. But, I think, here to the general denominator we shall come faster, than in a question from NHL.

Q. Still, you discussed the question concerning the forming a potion union of employees. What is it’s state?
A. It is a new organization establishment which is stipulated by the law. She will act in the role of negotiator with trade unions.

Q. That is we are available to strike? We have a trade union of players, there is a union of employers...
A. No, there will be no strike. The fact is that in Russian law there is no such norm. There are strikes, but it already something another.

Q. You still should consider a question on televising the of Russian Championship. There are any news on this subject?
A. The channel "Sports" will this year show a minimum of 120 matches of the Russian Championship. Besides hockey can be seen on the channel "NTV-PLUS"

[ahtikullervo]

Shalaev interview

Sorry guys, it is in Russian and I am not ready to do it too... Still it is very interesting stuff... Looks like this declaration of war is serious. Shabalov still is convinced that Team Russia will play in Olympics & Worlds...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'll translate this is you give me a bit. I'll post it once it's done.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[ahtikullervo]

Good work, kimi!!!

"First of all, we shall meet the management of the IIHF, we shall discuss the situation with them. Then we shall begin negotiations and with NHL."

So Bettman has to get back into the ring again? Goodenow KO on his belt, is he ready for another fight before the NHL season kicks off???

Cold war between NHL & NHLPA behind, what will the temperature in this one be? Some comments bringing Lubyanka in, were kind of shocking.

Could You imagine Burke, Clarke or Hitchcock calling up to meet these Russian leaders in desert and use some nice stuff experimented on Indians a couple of hundred years ago???

[Kimi]

Good work, kimi!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks, Ahti. There will be some mistakes in it, I got confuesd where is was on about the new union. But people can get the jist of it. I hope that I can read and speek Russian someday, I've bought a few audio CDs to help me.

Back on topic. I think most of the problem is because the NHL think only for them selves, relying on a lot of players going over because of the money they can pay. But now Russia is at a stage where they can give a lot of money. Players are starting to look at playing at home make a little less than flying too the USA and Canada. The PHL feels that they should now have a better deal because of this.

I'm interested in why no American sites have shown this. Maybe they are scard of the truth and won't admit that some players are likeing Russia more than there?

[ahtikullervo]

Maybe the "new NHL" is fragile product that could face its first major shock if Datsyuk, Frolov, Malkin & Co will stay in Russia.

[SacredCow]

This is very similar to the problems that MLB has with Cuba.

My feelings about Russia is that they are being absurd. The NHL has the greatest hockey talent in the world...period. Players that want to be a part of that should be welcomed and encouraged to participate. If you, instead, want to stay home and play in the Russian Leagues, go right ahead!

If a NHL team drafts a player, then they get the rights to that player with regards to the NHL, but that's it. If the guy doesn't want to come over, he shouldn't have to. But, he shouldn't be allowed to change his mind three years later and sign with another NHL team.

I remember hearing how Sergei Fedorov had to be snuck out of the country in order to come to the NHL and that kind of stuff is absurd. It's 2005 and it's hockey. It really shouldn't be this complicated.

[ahtikullervo]

Money makes them complicated.

It started with money, that took guys like Yashin and others into Finnish league, from there even bigger money took them to NHL. Now the same money drives them back in the opposite direction. Why are the guys blamed? They have leased their cars and stuff, Goodenow and Co promised to fight for their rights to keep their life stanndards and ... failed. Now there are guys (Abramovich who singlehandidly re-arrenged World soccer market & others) giving 'em 2nd option.

I have never seen any NHL side of wondering what deal could have connected for how strong contract for Stastny brothers, Mogilny or anybody else escaping from behind of the iron curtain...

Strange World we live in. What seems black and white from one side could be whole lot different from the other...

[Kimi]

This is very similar to the problems that MLB has with Cuba.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Could you give me a few details on this please? I don't know much about the happerning in baseball. I just watch the odd game when I can

[ahtikullervo]

Is Cuba paying more to some guys than MLB???

[ahtikullervo]

And tsn.ca report on the issue: Russian clubs want to negotiate their own transfer deals directly with NHL clubs so they can get more money.

- All other European federations have ratified the agreement.

- NHL deputy commissioner Bill Daly had no comment on the matter when reached Monday.

- The whole point of this formula was to appease the Russian clubs, which frequently lose top prospects such as Ilya Kovalchuk, Alexander Ovechkin and Evgeni Malkin to the NHL.

- The new formula would value a first overall draft pick at $900,000 US, the second overall pick at $880,000, third overall at $860,000, all the way down to 30th overall decreasing by $20,000 each time.

---

I guess i was right for the reason no Russians were picked earlier... It is money war. NHL clubs are teaching Russians a lesson. But sometimes things can turn around, can't they?

[Kimi]

There is going to be a lot of troble just because Americans and Canadians do things different. If there wasn't a draft this wouldn't be happening.

Am I right when I think that with out the a deal, if the Russian team has a the player under contract that an NHL team wants, then the NHL team would have to pay the Russian team to wave the contract and let him go. But if the player is out of contract, then the team in Russia gets nothing. To me, that sound exactly like it is in sports in here in Europe. It also sounds 100% fair.